Welcome to the third installment of Unchained. The first two are here and here. I met Jenn, as I have probably most of you, through someone else’s blog. I liked her “style” and bookmarked it. Since then we have contributed to the comment section of each other’s blog. Jenn blogs at Random Thoughts. While there, make sure you check out the pic of her pride and joy, 6 year old Shiloh. She is going to be a heart-breaker some day. 🙂 Jenn’s Unchained testimony is long but well worth reading.
When Bill asked me to write about my experiences with legalism, I thought it would be easy, but I have struggled with it more than I expected to. The worst of the legalism that I was a part of happened when I was so young that I really don’t know where to start.
I grew up in a strict home. There are things about the way I was raised that I absolutely appreciate, and there are things that I don’t agree with now that I’m an adult. What I didn’t realize until recently was that I grew up in a very legalist church (and because of that, also a legalistic household).
I knew the church I went to as a child was different. I knew there were problems and that the church split when I was in second grade. I even had memories of my pastor’s picture being in the newspaper, but I was too young to understand why.
It wasn’t until I was an adult that my cousin told me that she was studying about my former church in college, because it was labeled a cult. That made me curious so of course I Googled it. The things that I read brought back memories of from my childhood, and also explained some things to me.
The church I grew up in was founded in the late 60’s, but it started to become very authoritarian around the time I was born (1980), according to what I read. It still amazes me that one man could manipulate three thousand church members enough to destroy their lives, but he did.
The pastor had many rules and he enforced them by encouraging church members to report each other’s faults to him. Church members didn’t celebrate Christmas or Easter (I never celebrated either holiday until I was a teenager and my dad finally allowed it). Certain Christian books and bookstores were bad because they were spreading “false creeds”. Couples were not allowed to become engaged unless the pastor’s wife was informed first. Anyone that had a rebellious attitude was said to be possessed by the demon of rebellion. Visitors to the church were looked at with suspicion and often asked to leave.
The things I’ve mentioned are things I read about the church, but I don’t personally remember because of my age at the time (although I do remember plenty of talk about the demon of this or that). Now I’ll tell you a few of the things that I remember from my childhood, and that I have since learned were because of the church we attended.
To begin with, my brother and sister and I were born at home with the help of a midwife from the church. There is nothing wrong with this exactly, except that along with everything else I’ve learned, it just seems like one more way that the church kept its members separate from the world and even other Christians.
My family didn’t have a TV when I was a child, and anyone that did have a TV was “bad”. I can remember standing on my neighbor’s back porch and watching Full House through the glass door because I wasn’t allowed to watch TV. Also, secular music was bad, along with Contemporary Christian music. All I can actually remember listening to were tapes from the church.
The women all had to wear dresses, which is probably why I never wear dresses now. I was a tomboy and I had to wear shorts under my dresses so that I could still climb trees and wrestle with the boys. Oh, and jean skirts were a no-no also. Apparently the women were supposed to be very feminine and wear soft colors and lots of ruffles.
We also had to keep our hair long. I chopped all my hair off when I was eleven (we were not part of the church by then but my dad still followed most of their rules). What can I say? I’m a rebel I guess. My dad told me it was ugly and I cried, but as soon as it started to grow, I cut it again and when he made a comment about it, I didn’t cry.
We also couldn’t eat pork or shellfish. We weren’t Jewish, but for some reason the pastor decided that the foods were “unclean”.
My parents never owned a home until after we left the church. I recently found out that the pastor discouraged members from buying homes. I’m not sure why though.
The church also had a Bible college and elementary school. I don’t have a problem with Christian schools or colleges, but the church condemned people if they chose to send their children to secular schools instead. My brother and sister and I attended the church’s school even though it was expensive and my parents could barely afford it. Also, from what I have read online as an adult, they didn’t accept outsiders into the school. It was just another way to brainwash church members.
There are things that happened in the church before it split that were very strange. I won’t go into all of it simply because this post will go on for days. The things I’m skipping have more to do with the cult side of the church than legalism, although the two probably went hand-in-hand. To quickly sum it up, before the church finally split, there were affairs, divorces, suicides (including my mom’s best friend), a little girl was murdered by her mother “to protect her from the demon of hyperactivity”, several children were sexually abused by high ranking men in the church, and many friendships were destroyed.
Thankfully I was young enough that I wasn’t hurt too much by the things that happened at my former church. Sadly that isn’t the case for most. My dad, for example, has never found another church “that teaches the truth” so he doesn’t attend church.
I can’t explain why people were deceived the way they were by this pastor since I don’t understand it myself. I think that people were probably so involved in the church that they were afraid to leave. The pastor made sure people cut all ties to the outside world. When people rebelled and were “disfellowshipped” they had nowhere to turn.
Learning more about the church I came from has helped me to understand myself a little more. Even though I feel like I wasn’t affected by everything that went on, I know I was on some level. I have always been very skeptical of spiritual things. Not of God or the Bible, but of the things people say and do. I don’t blindly follow a pastor or a church. I question everything.
I have a hard time with people throwing out things like, “You can’t be a Christian if you do _____.” I’m not condoning living a lifestyle contrary to what the Bible teaches, and then calling yourself a Christian (that bothers me too), but some well meaning people come up with some crazy stuff. I’ve heard people say you can’t be a Christian if you’re Republican and I’ve heard others say you’re not a Christian if you’re a Democrat. I’ve also heard someone say that my pastor “destroyed our church” when he sold the old pews (after the church voted and agreed to it) and purchased pew chairs instead. Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t think the fact that your church had pews is going to get you into Heaven.
I still struggle with the idea of grace. I believe it completely, but I also have to constantly remind myself that my salvation isn’t in a checklist. I think this is probably because things were so legalistic in my home and church when I was a child.
I think that some good came out of my experience. My skeptical nature makes me study and search the scriptures for myself so that I will know if I’m being deceived. And I believe that God is big enough for my questions. I pray for discernment and I am constantly on guard so that I don’t allow myself to put my pastor on a pedestal. (And I also pray for my pastor and the other leaders in the church.) I’m involved in my church – very involved – but I could easily walk away if things got weird. And if I had to leave my church it would not affect my relationship with Jesus or keep me from finding another church.
From Bill: quite a story. I was privy to the church she was raised in and due to certain reasons, she chose to leave out the name. Trust me: it was a cult. The dude even went off and started another one! Anyway, please feel free to comment. Jenn’s schedule has her back at school so she will answer your comments when she has time. Thanks for coming by.
Jenn you say:
“It still amazes me that one man could manipulate three thousand church members enough to destroy their lives, but he did”.
I agree that it does seem amazing and yet I think it is done on some level in many churches. Just not to the extent that you have experienced.
I can relate to keeping the people isolated from the ‘world’ and other ‘christians’. This was similar to the church that I attended from 1982 to about 1993.
I think fear is used as a way to manipulate and control. People are taught to fear what they don’t have to fear. Our ‘pastors’ even tried to isolate their church people from their own parents, siblings, and so on.
We were expected to be at the church when the doors opened. Sunday morning, Sunday night, and Wednesday night.
I think you are exceptional in some ways. Most people coming out of a cult or out of legalism will end up in a similar church dynamic again because they feel more comfortable in these types of churches.
The church I attended also had a church school. It was small. I didn’t want to send my kids there but it was expected of all church members.
I think we do end up perceiving some good having come from the bad we experienced in these abusive churches. We learn some things hopefully. It does not surprise me that many people from your past church are stuggling with the idea of church and religion. People get badly hurt. There’s a saying ‘once bitten – twice shy’.
But, like you, we must go on with God. I’m glad that you have.
I think only someone who has been through something like this (as you have Linda) can truly understand all the emotions and thoughts Jenn expressed. thanks for your thoughts. I, too, am glad she continued on with God (and you also). Thanks.
Thanks Linda. I can see how it would be easy to end up in the same type of church again. I’m very thankful that I didn’t. My brother actually got involved in a similar church as a young adult. He finally left the church, but now he has a lot of anger and doesn’t trust any churches.
“salvation isn’t in a checklist”
Best. Line. Ever.
Great job Jenn!
i’m gonna have to “borrow” that phrase on my facebook status! lol…
I like that also Arny. Too bad more do not know that. They would find grace and freedom. She did do a great job. Thanks for going to her site and then here. 🙂
That stuck out to me too Arny.
Thanks Arny. Go for it. You are welcome to the line. 🙂
What a horrible experience. I am glad you survived and have come to rely on your own thinking and skepticism. I am sure there are many not so lucky.I only wonder why you feel it is important to not identify the cult and the leader? It just seems to me that such abusers should be identified so as to maybe protect others in the same trap. Nonetheless thanks for the story.
Thanks for the comment jeff. i will make a preliminary answer since she and I “talked” about that. One word: fb. “Discussions” take place between former members and others debating the merits of the pastor, etc. She does not want hassled if someone should google it and find the post. I could tell you but have not received her okay to do so. When she comes to respond, I will let her decide that. But, you are right, abusers need identified. just not sure the best way to do that.
I understand her reluctance to name names. I’ve been on the receiving end of retribution.
Jeff, Bill explained this exactly as I would have. It just seems like there has been quite a bit of interest in the church recently from former members, or maybe it’s just that they can all talk to each other on FB now. I’m not sure. But my dad is on a FB page for former members (I am not, but I’ve seen the page) and there is constant arguing on there and I don’t want to be part of it.
I don’t mind if Bill emails you the name of the church and/or pastor, or you are welcome to email me at jennlee_123 (at) yahoo.com and I can tell you. That goes for anyone else that wants to know the name of the church. It’s not a secret, I just don’t want people googling the name and finding my blog through this one. Thanks for understanding. 🙂
Jenn, thank you for telling your story. My heart goes out to you. Having been in churches with cult-like behaviors, I know how destructive that can be. I cried for you as I read your story.
You would understand Susan. Thanks for encouraging her.
Thank you Susan for your understanding.
I’m so sorry. I’m so sorry anyone had to go through this.
There is sorrow for sure Michael. That is one of the reasons we need to be faithful to the Word and open our hearts to others and decry religion. Thanks for caring.
Thank you. I’m sorry for others who have or are going through this also. I feel like talking about it might be able to help someone else to get out of a similar situation.
I am with Michael and the others. It is sad that anyone have to go through things like this. I have seen it with a church in the area I grew up in and I saw how damaging it is.
Thanks Jenn for sharing and Bill for allowing her to use his platform to do so.
You’re welcome Jim. Hoping these help open eyes.
“I still struggle with the idea of grace. I believe it completely, but I also have to constantly remind myself that my salvation isn’t in a checklist.”
wow.
i can’t wrap my brain around these stories. Jenn – glad you are still in church. Praying you experience God’s grace as He intended. I’ve struggled with grace. I’ll make sure others know they are covered with grace but have a hard time accepting it for myself. God’s chipping that off of me though 🙂
thank you for sharing!
You are saying what I have told her Craig. I am so glad she found out about grace and even though she struggles with it, allows God’s grace to be real. Thanks.
Isn’t it strange how it’s easy to accept God’s grace for others, but not for ourselves? God’s chipping that off of me as well. Thanks for your comment.
Thanks for sharing your story and Bill, thanks for allowing these stories to be shared with us. It amazes me as well that this stuff goes on and that people can be manipulated and controlled in these manners. Praise God, He accepts us as we are and not as someone else wants us to be!
You’re welcome Sele. I am glad to be able to offer them. I want badly for people to learn about grace.
“Praise God, He accepts us as we are and not as someone else wants us to be!”
Very true. Thank you Sele.
Jenn- I can relate alot with your story. I was raised quite in a pretty strict, conservative home, which led to lots of skepticism in later in life. On the positive side, like you, I’ve been able to see how that’s not always bad, and how skepticism can be holy, in the way of searching out truth and being sure of what you know. Thanks so much for sharing your story! I look forward to following your blog.
Glad you can understand Stephen but also glad you have found the truth after searching. Thanks.
Thank you Stephen. For me now, I just have to be careful not to be too skeptical of everything. I am constantly praying that God will give me the wisdom to search out truth without becoming a cynic in the process.
Wow. I don’t really know what to say. I guess incorrect doctrine can have a powerful effect. It’s also convicting to me as a father to think about the impact that my choices can have on my children. I hope to leave them a worthwhile legacy of faith and truth. Thanks for sharing, Jenn.
What a great takeaway Loren! Being the father who leave a worthwhile legacy is so important. I know you will. Thanks for the comment.
Loren, I love that you came to that conclusion from my story. I hope you will always consider the legacy you are leaving for your children. (And I pray the same for myself and all the other parents out there as well.)
I am so excited to see so many commenting and encouraging Jenn. In case you missed it, I will reiterate. Jenn is back at school (college teaching degree) and will comment later today. Thanks for understanding. Keep the comments coming!
Hi Bill, I’ve been reading your blog for a while now and have enjoyed my visits.
Jenn thank you so much for sharing. Unfortunately there are lots of similar cults around. I’m so glad you are free of that particular one, and I pray your father will find peace and Christians teaching truth he can fellowship with. My hubby and I “walked through” a similar situation once. I say walked through because we weren’t there long and just kept on walking. We did however, counsel several dear people through the years who were trapped, or had left, situations like you describe.
Hi Betty Jo! Thanks for visiting. Thanks for encouraging Jenn. Fortunately, you were one who “kept on walking” but so grateful you have made yourself available to others.
Betty Jo, I’m glad that you and your husband had the wisdom not to stay in a situation like that. That is wonderful that you have been able to counsel others.
Wow! I wish I had more to say, but just… wow.
Man, Moe, we must be long lost brothers (as Jim said yesterday). That was my first reaction when I read her story. Thanks.
Wow is enough Moe. I understand. Even though it is my story, when I started researching some of it a bit more, I was pretty shocked as well. Thanks for reading.
I appreciate the wisdom sought from the experience. I see Jenn as the example of how to use the free will of God; to use any experience to learn and grow in Him.
Many people would use that as an excuse to go their own way and do their own thing. It takes a real person of God to see the flaws in all of us and continue to serve. Good for her! There’s a lesson in there for all of us. Thanks Jenn.
She shows wisdom for sure Floyd. I am praying she continues using it for others as well. Thanks.
Thank you Floyd. I’m so thankful that God protected me from bitterness and anger. My dad and I have never gotten along too well, but now that I see where he is coming from, it has been easier for me to extend grace to him as well.
I am stunned that this happens. It makes me so sad that you had to go through this Jenn. I will pray for God’s grace & healing for you. Thank you for sharing such a personal story. You are very strong.
thanks for the comment Jan. Jenn will appreciate it.
Thank you. I’m glad that I was able to share the story with all of you. Maybe someone else can benefit from my experience.
What an incredible story. Jenn, I am so glad you escaped this life.
I agree on both points. 🙂
Thanks. I’m grateful that my mother had the wisdom to find a church that taught God’s Word after my family left the church/cult. My dad never went back to any church, but my mom continued to take us (my siblings and myself) to church. If she hadn’t done that, I don’t know where I would be now spiritually.
Jenn, I can relate to many things you’ve said. It’s a scary thing when people think that they’re God, and are able to manipulate others. I’m glad you were able to move away from that.
That is a scary thing jon. thinking they are from God but able to manipulate.
Hi everyone. Thank you for all the comments. And thank you Bill for allowing me to share my story.
Today was my first day back at school for the semester and I just got home and only had time to feed the little one before heading to church. I will be back later tonight to comment on everyone’s comments. I’m not ignoring you, I promise!
What a great series in light of the recent hub-bub of the YouTube video by Jeff Bethke.
I’m so happy to hear that Jenn’s faith has remained in tact with this as part of her story. So many people who go through these kinds of things want nothing to do with God or church, and have been so wounded. I pray that the others who were wounded by this man and other “churches” like this are able to find the One True God and a loving community of believers.
Thanks for the kind words Keri. I am going to check out this Jeff guy. No clue who he is. So glad you took the time to visit. I have read your blog but need to be more consistent.
God bless you Jenn!
Pastor…I know we are in the age of grace-but would it be “OK” if we stoned this guy?
Haha! Ike, your comment made me laugh.
Yeah, I chuckled also.
I pray for the same thing Keri. Thanks for your comment.
I’m speechless at reading this. It makes me sick Jenn had to go through this.
Sadly, she is just one of thousands.
Thank you for reading Jason. Bill is right, sadly this isn’t an isolated incident.
Thanks to all of you, and a special thanks to Jenn for taking part and expressing your thoughts. Be praying for her as she juggles motherhood, school, and life, all while sorting out her own walk with Jesus.
Jenn- first off, thank you for sharing what you did. I appreciate your honesty and transparency in sharing all this. I’m sorry to hear that you had to go through this growing up, but I’m grateful that God reminds you today that grace, love and second chances are abundant to you right now.
Thanks Dustin for your comment for Jenn.
I’m grateful for those things as well. God is good. Thanks for reading Dustin.